Passive Powerhouse – Mastering The Formula for Financial Freedom

Mastering The Formula for Financial Freedom Podcast with Dave Wolcott


Passive Powerhouse – Mastering The Formula for Financial Freedom

by The Formula for Financial Freedom Podcast with Dave Wolcott and Patrick Grimes


Dave Wolcott: When I started my wealth journey back in 2000, I was determined to find a better way to build wealth than being a retail investor in the stock market. I just knew I could beat the 7% return and also have more control over my financial future. Rich Dad Poor Dad had just come out at the time and there were very limited resources to learn the playbook of the ultra wealthy. I poured through every book I could get my hands on and was actively networking to grow my relationship capital. I remember being so frustrated that no one knew what I was talking about. At gatherings, people only wanted to talk about their 401k, the latest stock pick, or how many years they had until retirement. I knew this wasn’t for me. I know many of you are feeling the same way. So we created the Pantheon Mastermind and Virtual Family Office for ambitious entrepreneurs and investors like you, a forum where like-minded can learn, grow, and provide accountability together taking their wealth to 10 million, 20 million and beyond. Deeper insights into wealth strategies of the ultra wealthy and plug into a faculty of advisors that literally took me 20 years to curate where everyone speaks the same language is a subject matter expert in alternative strategies and becomes part of your team to meet your wealth vision. If you’re an accredited investor and would like to learn more, go to tenxyourwealth.com. Again, that’s tenxyourwealth.com. Patrick Grimes: I’ve joined Masterminds now just to be able to continuously get myself in front of people that are just killing it way better than I am and are the life division that I want to be in the next five, 10 years. If you do that in your professional career and you’re always looking forward to your professional career, you can also do that in your investing career. Speaker 3: Welcome to the Wealth Strategy Secrets of the Ultra Wealthy Podcast, where we help entrepreneurs like you exponentially build wealth through passive income to live a life of freedom and prosperity. Are you tired of paying too much in taxes, gambling your future on the stock market and want to learn about hidden strategies for making your money work for you? And now your host, Dave Wolcott, serial entrepreneur and author of the best-selling book, The Holistic Wealth Strategy. Dave Wolcott: Hey guys, welcome to today’s show on Wealth Strategy Secrets. I’m your host, Dave Wolcott, and today we are joined by Patrick Grimes. Patrick is the founder of Passive Investing Mastery and invest on Main Street. And I think you’re going to enjoy today’s episode where we talk about key attributes around what makes investors successful in different market dynamics. We’re also going to talk about alternative investing, why there’s challenges with traditional investing models, and then how Patrick actually transitioned from being a passive investor to an active investor and some of those dynamics that are not often discussed. So I hope you’ll enjoy the show. Hey, Patrick, welcome to the show. Patrick Grimes: Glad to be here. It’s been a long time hanging out with you in different meetings and Zoom calls and masterminds and it’s exciting to finally be among the elite. Dave Wolcott: Yeah. Grateful to have you on the show, Patrick. I know there’s going to be a lot of value here for the audience, and so why don’t we kick it off there. I know you were in the tech industry as well, have an engineering background. I mean, we share that in common, at least being in the tech industry. So how did you go from tech into real estate and how did you make that transition? What’s your backstory? Patrick Grimes: Yeah. So I started out as a machine design automation and robotics engineer. Got a mechanical engineering degree and loved it. Still do. I’m a geek even though I’m not doing it anymore. So I don’t think that leaves you. But early on when I was I doing some really fun projects like Lockheed, Raytheon, Boeing, Tesla, some really cool stuff. And early on I was given some advice by the founder of the company I was working for and he said that his only regret was not investing in more real estate sooner and recommended I invest as much as I can as soon as I can in real estate. I was so shocked because I was in this world where it was either your 401k or your company stock or you’re a day trader. There really wasn’t anything else that in my sphere of high tech geeks were really into. I went for it. I went into real estate and lost it all at first, but the global financial crisis took me down nine and 10, but I came out humbled and ready to invest a little bit more wiser. Dave Wolcott: What does that actually mean, you lost it all? Were you investing in single family rentals? What kind of asset types were you getting into and what led to that? Patrick Grimes: Yeah. Snot-nose engineer out of college, I was searching real estate for the highest returning deals. I wasn’t super concerned with risk and I didn’t quite understand what being a personal guarantee on a loan was, a fully recourse loan. I got into a pre-development. It was a group that had destroyed it on terms. They did great for the last three projects they had done. They doubled and tripled their money every couple years. So it was a great track record. I just didn’t zoom far out enough to see how development behaves in large market swings at the time. So I got involved in that and I was very high leverage. Just a lot of investors were back then with a first and a second balloon payments and all that on the land and we were fixing up the land and going to build on it. Unfortunately music stopped and I didn’t have a seat. It was upside down very quickly. My loan was bought and sold several times. I couldn’t get a hold of them, paid out of pocket for a long time. Finally realized there was no hope, found an attorney. He helped me negotiate debt forgiveness. I had a foreclosure, then I had to pay taxes on the debt forgiveness. It was pretty brutal. I mean, I was wrecked for a bit financially. Still a talented engineer, but it was an ego hit for sure. Dave Wolcott: And what would you say was your biggest learning lesson out of all that? Patrick Grimes: I learned what the difference between investing and speculating was. In pre-development, you’re hoping that you’ll have something worth the loan in the future. There’s a bet that we can make this land something that you can build on and that we could build on it eventually. And then once we get across that bridge that we can rent it or sell it for cash flow or a profit. And that’s a hope. Sometimes you won’t make it. Sometimes external factors like recessions. And what happens when you don’t have that parachute, you got that loan and you’re underneath it yourself. Well, they can come after you. That was a big lesson. I didn’t fully understand that. Recourse means I’m cross-collateralized. Everything I had done to that point was all on the hook for this one bad decision. And so it’s led me to think about wealth more like the tortoise and not the hare from then on, make more calculated decisions, investing in more recession-resilient assets and markets, and buying existing assets that had value in cash flow. That’s what led me into the single-family world and then ultimately large apartment buildings and other assets. Dave Wolcott: I mean, you must have had a credible amount of resiliency yourself to stay the course and stay onto real estate and not get completely frustrated. So did you make any kind of decision at that point to make a decision around active versus passive? Patrick Grimes: So when I got out of it, I decided I was going to double down on my career. I wasn’t sure I was going to jump back into real estate right away. In fact, I didn’t know if I was coming back to real estate. I got a master’s in engineering and an MBA, and I started doing incredibly well and got promoted at a larger, smaller company and I took a larger position. What happened when I started getting large bonus checks again and doing some really amazing projects is I needed to find where to invest. I was still in the same quandary as I was right out of college when I got that first good job. But I had that little voice in my ear, the wealthier investing in real estate. And when I started learning how they’re doing it, they’re not oftentimes speculating. Or if they are, they’re doing it with a smaller part of their portfolio or they’re doing it in a way where they don’t cross-collateralize everything, but oftentimes they’re buying existing assets where you can make a measurable improvement, but it’s worth the loan and it stands alone as own income producing product right off the bat. So the breadcrumbs of the wealthy led me right back to real estate. Now, as part of a diversified portfolio, I mean if you look at the TIGER 21 allocations, it’s 26% in real estate. So I had other assets and other kinds of investments, but as I approached how to do it again, I found Texas where in 2009 and ’10, it mostly leveled off the real estate market before it started going up again. Unlike in the coastal states like Orlando and in Los Angeles or ones like hospitality driven, Las Vegas, those one took 12 years to even just break even. Places like where I started investing at that point was Houston, and it went down a few quarters and leveled off for a year or two before it started picking back up. So I started buying a bunch in Houston, single-family homes, immediately cash flowing, but I can improve it measurably, refi out my money and do it again. And it was working. So that’s what got me back into it. Dave Wolcott: So has that experience really helped you shape your investment thesis today or do you have a particular wealth strategy or investor mandate that you’re working to? Patrick Grimes: Yeah. Well, I’m talking with one of the big wealth strategists here right now. So we can probably talk allocation wealth strategies for a while, but at that point it was all my own money and I was doing it like moonlighting it, right? Because I was also still doing engineering and while traveling the world, I spent two gap years traveling and whitewater rafting at the Grand Canyon, hiked to the base camp of Everest, done a bunch of really cool stuff, and it got to be where my investing career just became consuming all my time. At that point I realized I had to stop. So I met my wife and my soon-to-be wife and I took a break. And when I re-approached it, I added some new disciplines, which was the more balance between the personal life. It was I don’t have to do it all myself. I can learn how to partner and I can learn how to use other people’s money so I can scale and buy lower-risk assets, apartment buildings. So apartments building became my next journey and that’s when I founded our first private equity firm. And once that started growing is when we started diversifying other things like energy. We have a debt fund and we’re doing some other alternative investments which are non-correlated and a little bit unique, but ones that help to build up and fully round that portfolio. Dave Wolcott: Yeah. It makes sense. Do you have any kind of predetermined or kind of ideal portfolio allocation that you work towards with your investors? Patrick Grimes: It depends on their goals, and that’s typically what we do. If they go to my website and set up a meeting with me, we’ll see where they’re at in life, what their current allocations are like and where they’re looking to get. Some are looking to immediately retire with a ton of cash flow. Some are looking for more growth-oriented opportunities, and some have a bunch of real estate already that we’re looking to reposition. And some just need maybe some metal, some gold. We just did a webinar where we had both precious metal individuals on there, which are gold and silver and platinum. And then we had strategic metals where you can make a 20% return just by technology metals. So it depends on their… We usually kind of go real custom, the nitty-gritty to where they’re at, where they’re trying to get, and then help them round out their portfolio. Dave Wolcott: Patrick, let’s unpack the dynamics around really active investing versus passive investing. Because sometimes I feel that people just haven’t given this enough thought and they may… Let’s say one type of person could be a passive investor and who’s really excited about investing in real estate or some type of alternative asset. They’re very excited about it and then they feel that they might want to, the next level for them would be to move into active investing. And then sometimes you have active investors who I don’t think they’re reaching real fulfillment as an active investor. May not necessarily have been their calling. They may been chasing it for the wrong reasons because, “Hey, maybe it’s lucrative to get into real estate.” They heard the quote that more millionaires are produced being in real estate, so I’m going to go after that. And I think that truly as an entrepreneur, you’re actually looking for that freedom of purpose where you can really be fascinated and motivated about the work that you’re doing. So it’s okay to be excited about investing, but to take it into that active space, I think it’s just a different level of thinking. So what are your thoughts based on your journey around that? Patrick Grimes: Since I’ve done a little bit of both, I’ve got some articles that I’ve written on the topic in Forbes. I’ve got some asset, single-family versus multi family, active versus passive. A lot of people out there kind of get this allure of, “Hey, if I become… I can just do it all myself.” A lot of my more prevalent investors are doctors, they’re attorneys. They are people that have a high-paying job. They’re used to learning something and becoming the expert in that thing. They get this idea that, “Oh, you know what? I can also become an expert.” I thought I could be where I was a machine design automation robotics guy. Then I could also become an expert in real estate. Well, in order to be active, you need to do that, but they say it takes like 8,000 hours to master something. What unfortunately happens is you make unfortunate trades against your family, friends, hobbies, the purpose that you referred to earlier, and that takes away from your family life. What it trades it for is unfortunately a lesser returning portfolio oftentimes and sometimes at a higher risk. When I was doing single family actively myself, I was still having to sign on the loans, but I was buying a little bit better assets, but they weren’t not recourse loans like the apartment buildings. But I couldn’t buy an apartment building myself. So I was still cross-collateralizing, maybe a little bit safer, but I was still taking greater risks with each investment. And it wasn’t until I learned to partner and work with others and pull capital, did we get into lower risk assets. People that are willing and they went to the process, I didn’t. It took me to just basically burn the candle at both ends, doing all the jobs myself to the point where I couldn’t even get married to finally realize, “Look, I have to take a break from this to be two and a half years to learn how to partner with others, to learn how to use other people’s capital and to be able to scale.” Because actively, you can’t just buy one property as an active investor and get a great deal on it because after you’ve improved it or whatever your business plan is, that return, that IRR goes down every year. It goes down and eventually becomes a natural appreciation. So to keep you a velocity of capital high, you don’t just making one trade at one time with your time, you have to constantly take whatever that property was, improve it, buy another one, improve it, buy another one, improve it. And people just don’t like, that’s another job, that’s another career. And because you’re distracted doing whatever it is that you actually made money with in the first place, because you’re distracted, there’s somebody else that’s going to do better than you because that is their full time gig and that’s something that they’ve mastered. Oftentimes you can do a better return just by investing in that guy. And the limited partner less risk and overall you can diversify more, because you’re not in one place, maybe not down the road from you, but maybe you’re diversified in several states in several different asset classes. And people passively invest all the time like in the stock market and somehow that’s acceptable. Passively invest in active investments and passively investing in syndications allows for higher returning depreciable tax advantage growth and still the diversification across geographies, assets, and sponsors. So it’s a journey, but you have to learn how to partner, which is education all on its own. Dave Wolcott: Sure. I think the people who’ve really got it right are the ones who understand that time is actually your greatest asset. So that can really help you make that determination of active versus passive because like you say, you get into active because it might be exciting but before you know it, you have a full-time job. And that might be okay if that is your purpose and mission and that’s aligned to that, but if it’s not, you have created that job. And then the other thing is to your point, it becomes less scalable and you need to be thinking about it not just on the most immediate deal that you can do, but in the next five to 10. What does that trajectory actually look like? And put yourself there and say, “Does that align with my vision or not?” Patrick Grimes: Yeah, I think that there’s… the financial security, right? Financial freedom people talk about all the time. Ultimately, I think that there’s kind of the first tier, which is scarcity. You go from working hard at a job and people tend to spend everything they make regardless of how much they make, and they’re always in the sense of scarcity. So the first thing you got to do is read Robert Kiyosaki’s purple book and reduce your expenses so that you have surplus. And then the goal from there is to then get out of that job so that you have that time freedom. And the financial security part I think is where it’s a false sense of security when you’re making a lot and spending a lot, because you’re always on the verge. It’s when you can create a surplus that then you can put towards passive income and have that passive income then cover your bills. Now, when you reach that, you’re just covering your bills. That’s just the beginning because the purpose part, it’s that ability, which our mission is to not get people to financial security, but get them to a point at which they have a surplus that allows them to then contribute towards having the life that they want, and towards the causes they care about most in life. And for my wife and I, that’s been amazing because we’ve gotten to the point now where not only are we in a surplus position, but we’ve been able to put money away to create cashflow opportunities where you get this sense of, "Hey, now I can see beyond just my immediate needs. I can see beyond just covering our expenses. I can see towards what is that life we want to create by design." For example, during COVID, my wife came out one day and said, "Hey, I love our place. It’s a cute little spot in la, but we’re under curfew, we’re under quarantine. Riots are going on where there’s fires, smoke. Let’s move to Hawaii." Two and a half weeks later, I had us on a plane to Hawaii. That would’ve never happened had we not gone through those steps to get past the scarcity and the surplus into passive income and then into a place where we could live in a possibility and have a life by design. Dave Wolcott: Patrick, what do you see as some of the most successful strategies and tactics that investors deploy to really accelerate their wealth? Patrick Grimes: Well, so I have various articles I’ve written on IRA and 401k, and Forbes Investing. I’ve written some on 1031 exchanges. That was very powerful for me because I have real estate, ones that I was actively managing and they were small. They were not as profitable, and I wanted to trade those up in a more profitable, safer assets. 1031 exchanges, what they say is one of the final remaining tax advantage, the most powerful tax advantage tool available to Americans still. What I like to do with investors, again, is it’s so custom because I always put people in different perspectives, but our mission at Passive Investing Mastery is to take a look at when I was starting out engineering, as I mentioned before, I had no idea what the real estate world was or how to even approach it. I didn’t know that there were alternative investments. I didn’t know I could reach oil and gas investments. I didn’t know that there were debt funds that would allow me to become a lender and get very low risk cash flow to live off of. I didn’t know that any of this stuff. And we also have other things like a litigation fund that we’re launching, which allows for a completely non-correlated investment that doesn’t have any effect on gold, interest rates, doesn’t have any attachment to the real estate. It’s completely non-correlated investment, which allows you to balance out cash flow and growth. And so I’ll typically do is we’ll look at investors’ portfolios as I know you do too, Dave, and we’ll see what are those alternative investments where we can get their portfolio goals between cash flow and growth or metals like I said before, we can get a balance to get them where they want to get to as fast as possible in a way where they’re not all down in one thing in one year. They’re non-correlated investments. Dave Wolcott: Yeah. I appreciate that. We have a similar mission and really trying to help people just learn some of these alternative strategies that are really not taught and people just get sucked up into this Wall Street machine. If you look at the SPIVA report and look at the past 15 years, they’ll indicate that actual financial planners and active managers have actually underperformed the S&P 500 by 88%. Yet the majority of Americans, that’s still where they hold their capital. So I don’t know. I mean, I think financial literacy is really probably one of the top three reasons why people just don’t understand where else they can invest. But really helping to provide those insights to understand the risks, what you’re investing in, and then really align that to your investor DNA is just so much more powerful to be able to make an impact in achieving your goals. Patrick Grimes: Exactly. I think out of the Great Depression, they started the 401ks. They started all these things to try and get money back into the stock market. It was never meant to be the end all for a retirement because they had pensions too and all that evaporated as well. And some people, they’re still kind of living in the way that their grandfather lived. They’re living in a place where they get this false sense of security. They can put money in the stock market and it will be there. Unfortunately, it’s hard to keep it up with inflation. The IRA and 401k accounts that aren’t self-directed in alternative investments like ours, those are not performing in a way which will get you to the retirement that you’re looking for, but that’s what you’re supposed to do and that’s [inaudible 00:24:37]. I think it’s that education and why we have a Passive Investing Mastery series, which you’re going to be on, Dave. I’m looking forward to that. It’s going to be a great one where we’re just introducing investors to all the different kinds. It’s a blue ocean, all the different kinds of alt assets that they can participate in that are non-correlated to the stock market that provide tax advantage, cashflow depreciation and wealth because it is so difficult to just introduce it. I think it’s becoming more popular and I’m glad to say that I think that’s because the millennials are starting to get really disillusioned by the stock market. They’re starting to see, want to take a little more control than these financial planners. And even gold has tracked over the last 12 years with the S&P 500. So you would’ve done better if you’d have just bought a bar of gold in some cases and if you would’ve joined some of these. And oftentimes investors… Well, I don’t know if you get the same thing, Dave, but I’ll sit there and talk about, "I’ve been investing in real estate for 15 plus years. I’ve been up and down on different swings of the market, and here’s our strategy for putting together recession-resilient portfolio and investments." And they’ll say, "Okay. Let me go talk to my guy." "Well, who’s your guy?" "It’s a financial planner, financial planner that only took a six weeks course to become certified." And all he is going to do is put you into the index funds that he’s required to put you into because he’s an employee and he’s not allowed to, what they call, sell away. And you can’t blame him because he’s got to put money on his family’s table and if he points elsewhere points at other investments, he’s taken food off of his family’s table. So it’s a tough world when people are geared to trust these financial planners and trust these investment products, which ultimately underserve them and don’t meet their goals. And we just got to get them further into the know and educate them on the financial IQ of these alt assets that are available. Dave Wolcott: Yeah. Well, so to the listeners out there, April is actually Financial Literacy Month. Many people may not have realized. So maybe now is the time to actually make a commitment to understand some strategies, some asset classes and things that you’re going to learn about just like we’re also creating habits around learning, whether it’s self-development or professional development, but definitely dedicate some time to increasing your knowledge with something like Patrick’s investing mastery series or some other good resources out there. So, Patrick, what do you think about the current economic cycle? There’s just such a myriad of different dynamics happening all the time, and I think partly that’s sped up by the speed of information these days where instantly can hear things. So we just live in this world where everything is just very reactionary and also trying to weed through the data and actually find out what’s really important. We’ve got an election year. You can hear one side all day long, then you can hear the other side all day long. And so are you seeing any current trends right now being either actually negative trends, things to stay aware of or things that investors should be looking for as opportunities over the next five years? Patrick Grimes: It’s a really good point. There’s been obviously the rise in interest rates post-COVID here to fight the inflation, has impacted a number of markets, and one of those has been real estate. Back in 2009 and ’10 I was struggling. I got my head way over my skis and I was getting rigged over the coals. And when that was the best buying experience of my life, I missed out on it. Best buying opportunity of my life and I missed out on it. Right now, where we see the real estate markets is an opportunity, and I call it the recessionary upside of the downturns, taking advantage of that because although the market itself seems to be booming, there’s an aspect of it being propped up by our government’s overspending. Every 90 days worth a trillion dollars more in debt. It’s insane. It’s just hard to fathom the real assets. The tangible assets are those things that when bought correctly with low enough leverage and cashflow, those are the thingsthat tend to hedge with inflation. I have an article in Forbes about that. And so when you have an inflationary environment, a high interest rate environment, like we’re, the opportunities where it has an adverse effect on valuations in real estate or an appreciable effect on debt where interest rates are high in debt, investments are more profitable. Right now we’re seeing credible opportunities for investors where we’re acquiring assets right now, all cash commercial stuff at basis. We could never have done that in the last 10 years. I mean, we used to have to hold something for five years in order to get a return, like a 20, 30% IRR. But we just bought an asset for 4 million and immediately appraised for five. And so we can buy things right now in commercial real estate where you come in at such a low basis, you make the return on the buy. And that’s really neat because as an analyst, the idea of buying something and slowly improving it with infusing capital into it and hoping rents grow and hoping the appreciation grows, that calculus isn’t working right now. Inflation is affecting that. Insurance costs are going up, taxes have gone up. It’s hard to correlate CapEx infusion to appreciation. So that playbook isn’t quite penciling, but because you can buy right now and you can make the return on the buy, it’s an incredible buying time. And the people that made billions in 2009 and ’10, that’s what they did. Another impact of 2009 and 10 was that banks pulled back. Well, we have that right now. We’ve all heard of the news about banking collapses and banks being under stress. There’s a trillion and a half dollars in commercial real estate debt coming due in just 2025 alone. And the banks are having a liquidity crunch. The interest rates that went up affected their bond values. And when they sell their bonds, they have to sell them at a discount. So they don’t have money right now for two reasons. One is because the liquid assets that they kept, the bonds, they’re devalued, and the loans that they lent on aren’t paying off because they were mostly commercial. Regional banks, mostly commercial real estate loans. So what that effect is there’s a huge demand for commercial real estate debt. And where we used to get loans for like six, seven, 8%, some of those loans now are 10, 11, 12, 13% just because the demand was there. And as you saw in 2009 and ’10, private debt investors, private credit, people that came, private equity firms like what Dave and I have could come, and we could lend. We can fill that void and we can lend, but because we can move quicker and trust us to actually close them like regional banks, we can lend at really high rates. So what we’re seeing right now on the debt side, on the debt fund is income producibility that we’ve never been able to have before in a low risk asset class. We’re seven to 15% monthly annualized payments while being in a first position, senior secured debt. That’s not common equity where we see all this movement of valuations up top. This is down in that debt piece. And so investors have the opportunity right now to invest in debt and get high cashflow, immediate cashflow returns almost like what equity used to be like years ago, but at a much lower risk premium. I think those are potentially the two biggest opportunities right now. And a lot of people are not seeing them. It’s not really big in the news, but I’m sure, Dave, you and I, we see it every day and we’re pouncing on those opportunities. Dave Wolcott: Yeah, good insights on that, Patrick. Just switching gears for a moment, what is your biggest personal productivity hack, habit routine, peak performance gainer that you could share? Patrick Grimes: Sure. Well, so I’ve had this habit every single morning since college to go on a run. And so I run virtually every day. I’ll maybe take seven total days out of the year and not run usually because I get ill or something happens or I did a red-eye flight somewhere. But I run around the lake right behind me or I run on the beach when we’re in Hawaii, part-time there. But I listen to webinars and podcasts just like this one or audio books, self help leadership books or TED talks, inspirational things that help propel my day and help get my gears turning and get me sharp. It’s very common that I’ll do with… I don’t know if you’ve heard of the Miracle Morning, but Hal Elrod wrote it. Dave Wolcott: Yeah, Hal, sure. Patrick Grimes: Actually grew up next to Hal Elrod’s property, and he went to the same high school I went to interesting story. He used to trespass and swing on his rope swinging a lot as a kid. So I had a good laugh about that last time I saw him. I mean, I’ll run, listen, do the meditation, the scribing and my employees will probably attest to… Sometimes I’m sniping. I’m like, "Check this out. Or what do you think about this idea?" Wee hours of the morning before I even come in and they come in and there’s all these weird things. Ideas, Patrick has had that morning. But that has been such a cool mind, professional growth time for me where I can just run and be focused and listen and really consume some amazing content that helps to alter and keep me sharp and on my game. Dave Wolcott: Yeah, awesome. Now I can totally relate. It’s like working out is like brushing my teeth for me. I have to do it. It has to be there. One interesting thing, I think people just don’t make the connection is that actually when we learn, one of the ways to actually amplify your learning is to have heightened when your endorphins, your serotonin, your hormones are actually kicking a lot higher, you’ll actually intake the information much in a better way. And then you can actually put it to action. So when you are listening to podcasts or whatever, while you’re working out, it really amplifies the effect of it. So it’s a good little hack right there. If you could give just investors and the audience just one piece of advice about how they could truly move the needle on their own wealth journey, what would it be? Patrick Grimes: I usually say we’ve already touched on it, right? Do one passive step a day. That’s one podcast, one leadership book, and one active step a month, which is attend some kind of tribe, meet up, go to an event, something that gets you surrounded by people like what you want to become. And for me, that’s investing alternative investments. Find real estate people, find oil and gas, find metals, find something, find people that are open minded because it’s hard for anyone to get out of a pattern, especially if it’s like me. I didn’t come with it. My family didn’t bring this to me. I went to it and I had to find people a tribe. People don’t want to wander off into the desert by themselves. They want to band together with others, and we’re built that way. So find those people, I will stretch you, I will grow you. I’ve joined masterminds now just to be able to continuously get myself in front of people that are just killing it way better than I am and are the life, the vision that I want to be in the next five, 10 years. And if you do that in your  professional career and you’re always looking forward to your professional career, you can also do that in your investing career. And those steps, those small steps will make bigger leaps for you in your overall happiness and ability to retire early. Dave Wolcott: Great stuff, Patrick. Really appreciate all the wisdom and your time today with the audience. And if people want to connect with you or learn more about what you guys are doing, what’s the best place for them? Patrick Grimes: So if you go to passiveinvestingmastery.com, it’s passiveinvestingmastery, all spelled out, .com. Sorry, it’s so long. That’s our website. You can see all the investments we have up there, the mastery series where we bring on different sponsors, including Dave and dozens of others, have all different types. We have all the history there too, of all the ones that we’ve had before, but all kinds of extraordinary types of investments from laundromats, ATM funds, parking, mobile home, metals, strategic metals, all kinds of stuff. You can learn about all these sponsors and all these ability to invest in different ways. Check it out. I recommend everybody do that. There’s a link. You can set a meeting up on my calendar and we can have a chat wherever you’re at. I don’t have a one-size-fits-all type of approach. Wherever you’re at, what’s your goals are and where you’re going, we do our best to get you pointed in the right direction, whether worth it or not. I love talking to investors. It’s one of the things that I love about what I get to do now that I’m full-time in this gig and have been for some time now. But if you want to hear my whole story, you’re welcome to have a free copy of my book. It’s called Persistence Pivots and Game Changers Turning Challenges and Opportunities. And I’m on here, I still had hair back then. And I co-authored this. Phil Collen, guitarist of Def Leppard did a chapter, an actual rock star. A couple other people on here that NFL, NBA players, an athlete. It was such a fun project. I had such a great time doing it, but man, I bought a ton of these. I signed them and send them out if you go to passiveinvestingmastery.com/book. So that is the secret link. Put in the name of Dave’s podcast or put in Dave’s name so I know you are… We don’t ship them out for free to everybody, but fill that promo code with the name of Dave’s podcast and I’ll sign it, get it out to you. And I tell my whole story of how I lost it all, my ebbs and turns through high tech in between companies and the single family and got married in Beijing and then larger scale multi. I tell all the stories how we ended up and why it’s really cool. And if it inspires anybody to have a journey on the path that I’ve had, then I’ve done my part. Dave Wolcott: Awesome. Appreciate that, Patrick. We’ll make sure we link to that in the show notes as well. Thanks again for your time today. Patrick Grimes: Appreciate it. Thanks so much and looking forward to having you on our series. Speaker 4: Thanks for listening to this episode of Wealth Strategy Secrets. If you’d like to get a free copy of the book, go to holisticwealthstrategy.com. That’s holisticwealthstrategy.com. If you’d like to learn more about upcoming opportunities at Pantheon, please visit pantheoninvest.com That’s pantheoninvest.com.